Decoder with Nilay Patel · 2025-09-04 · 36 min · 6,059 words

The quest to keep OpenAI honest

Listen to the original audio · Transcribed with NVIDIA Parakeet · Timestamps stay in sync with the live audio

Hey everyone, welcome to Decoder. I'm Alex Heath, Deputy Editor at The Verge, and your Thursday episode guest host. We've covered OpenAI in several ways this summer, from how it's navigating the AI talent wars to how people are starting to feel attached to Chat GPT. Next week we're airing a recent conversation I had with Brett Taylor, the chairman of OpenAI's board. But today, I want to zoom in on the battle that's brewing about the future of OpenAI itself.

Despite being one of the most valuable companies in the world, OpenAI is still technically a non-profit. That structure was designed back in 2015 to keep investors from steering artificial intelligence in ways that could harm humanity. It's also what set the stage for the dramatic board coup in 2023 that briefly ousted Sam Altman as CEO. And now OpenAI is trying to shake this nonprofit structure so that it can raise even more money and eventually go public. There's a lot at stake here, and not just for OpenAI.

To unpack why it matters, today I'm joined by Catherine Bracie, CEO of Tech Equity, and Orson Ailad. CEO of Latino Prosperity. They help run Eyes on OpenAI, a coalition of advocacy groups that's challenging OpenAI's attempted restructuring. As you'll hear, Catherine and Orson argue that OpenAI has enjoyed the advantages of being a nonprofit while drifting away from its mission. It's a complicated, fascinating story that cuts to the heart of how the most important AI company in the world is structured and the impacts of that structure.

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