Decoder with Nilay Patel · 2025-08-25 · 53 min · 8,590 words

Is ChatGPT killing higher education?

Listen to the original audio · Transcribed with NVIDIA Parakeet · Timestamps stay in sync with the live audio

Hello, this is Dakoter senior producer Cade Cox. As you can tell, I'm still not Eli. Sorry, but I do hope you've been enjoying our series of guest hosts this summer while he's out on parental leave. We hear the family's doing well and we look forward to him coming back. But until then we have a few more really great guest episodes coming up, so stay tuned.

The production team is taking our own break this week, so while we're off, we're excited to share this episode of the gray area with you. Students all over the country, including my own kids, thank goodness, are back in school right around now, so we thought it would be a perfect time to revisit host Sean Illing talking with journalist James Walsh about how AI tools like ChatGPT have kicked off a new cheating arms race that's proving extremely disruptive to college education. There are a lot of big decoder ideas and problems wrapped up in all this. Okay, the gray area with Sean Illing. Enjoy.

What's the point of college if no one's actually doing the work? It's not a rhetorical question. More and more students are not doing the work. They're offloading their essays, their homework, even their exams to AI. Tools like ChatGPT, Claude, Copilot, they're not just study aids.

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