Luke Harding and Alastair Campbell: Trump, Putin and the New Age of Conquest (Part Two)

Welcome to Intelligence Squared where great minds meet. I'm senior producer Mia Sorenti. In this episode we return for part two of our recent live event with Guardian foreign correspondent Luke Harding and former Downing Street Director of Communications Alistair Campbell. Together they examine Trump, Putin and the return of great power politics. and what the changing balance between power, alliances and international law could mean for the future of global security.

If you haven't heard part one, do just jump back an episode to catch up. And a quick content warning before we get started, this episode contains some explicit language. Now let's return to the conversation live at King's Place in London. The thing is that so he Donald Trump was a very, very well-known business figure, somebody of an enormous profile for a very, very long time. And the Russians developed an interest in him and then a relationship with him.

And when we were, you know, when when I worked for the government, whenever we went to Russia, they basically said, listen, don't do anything and don't say anything that you wouldn't want to you know, see have your people closest to you seeing because they are filming, taping absolutely everything that you say and that that was the secret briefing you got that you've just told me that you just yeah yeah yeah but I mean you're right and you know I I know from my I mean j just to spool back, w w when I when I was in Moscow, I One of the stories I investigated was the murder of Alexander Levanienko, which was done by the FSB. So I was looking at the the the successful agency to the KGB, you know, writing stories and trying to investigate why the Russian state might kill him and the role of the security services. And, you know, within a few weeks of of my kind of going going off on this story, we had mysterious break-ins at the family apartment where I was living in in Moscow with my British wife Phoebe and our two two small kids.

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