Churchill and de Gaulle: a strange relationship

Welcome to the History Extra podcast. After France fell in 1940, it was Charles de Gaulle who led the three French forces against Nazi Germany and Vichy France. From the moment he assumed that position, de Gaulle was locked into a relationship with British Prime Minister Winston Churchill. The two men and their relationship is a subject explored in depth by Richard Vynan in his new book. The Last Titans.

Here, in conversation with James Osborne, he shares his insights into these leading figures, the dynamics between them, and their lasting impact. Richard, your book, The Last Titans, is this twin portrait of Winston Churchill and Charles de Gaulle. Before we begin looking at these two men, can you first take us into the changing world that they inhabited and perhaps the geopolitical context of their two countries? Because we know them both as war leaders.

But there's also much more to it, isn't there? So when Churchill is born in 1874, Britain is really the most powerful empire the world has ever seen. And when de Gaulle is born in 1890, France is not quite the same kind of power, but she's still a great imperial power with large possessions overseas, and Britain and France are in lots of ways kind of dominant powers, although In economic terms, America is already on the horizon. America's a military power is nothing compared to Britain and France at that stage.

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